[PS5] Can we talk about how realistic this sim is? (Warning: long post!)

I often see people claiming that MSFS is pretty realistic. I even saw a post on Reddit from someone claiming to be a pilot and he said that flying in this Sim is even harder than flying IRL.

So, a few weeks after buying the Sim for the PS5, I got curious. At this point I had used the Joby for the majority of my flights, because it’s very easy to fly and my focus was on sightseeing. I’d say that I used the Joby for about 80% of my flights. The rest was GA, mostly the XCub, the DA40 and the Cessna 172. Although for those planes, I often ended the flight mid air. I had done about 5 or 6 landings and not all went well.
For Airliners, I did check out the Boeing 747, the Airbus 320 and the Beluga, but all I did was take off, and fly a few minutes. I’d say I spent less than 20 minutes on Airliners.

So, what did I get curious about? You all know the good, old question: Could a passenger land an Airliner if he/she had to?
Now I’m aware that will probably never happen IRL, at least not for Airliners, but here I am, with very little knowledge and experience and a Sim that is supposed to be pretty realistic. That’s my chance! I want to try this!

So to sum it up: All my knowledge and experience comes from flying the Joby for about 100 hours (which was just take off>get altitude>set level>enjoy the scenery) and about 10-15 hours in GA. And, pretty important, I watched quite a few of Mentour Pilot’s videos, so I know a bit about the systems of an airliner and that those can (and will) interfere in certain situations and under certain circumstances.

Now there was one big problem: Usually, when you think about a scenario where a passenger needs to land an Airliner, this passenger has some help. Usually over the radio. But I don’t know any pilot or someone working in aviation, so I had to do this on my own.
Now, that may sound strange and a bit overconfident, but if something like this would happen to me in real life and there’s no one else who’s qualified, yes, I indeed think I would volunteer before someone else does, simply because I would trust myself more than someone else who I don’t know.
And yes, I think that there would indeed be a small chance for me to bring an Airliner down, without a serious(!) crash and without ppl dying IF I had some help. But on my own? No way! I’m pretty confident when it comes to things like this, but I’m not a fool!

So, I set up a flight from Europe to Miami with the A330, which I haven’t touched before. 200+ ppl on board. All assists off, everything set to “realistic”. I started in air about an hour away from the destination.
And it was perfect, because when I clicked “ready to fly” the plane was immediately out of control with alarms ringing.
Now of course you can never replicate how someone would feel if something like this happened IRL, but I took this serious and I was obviously nervous 'cause I clicked the wrong buttons on my controller a few times.

First thing I did was to stabilize the plane. No problem.
Next, I tried to engage the AP but it didn’t work.
It took me quite some time to realize that there’s a red warning showing on the display. Now that’s something I learned from Mentour Pilot’s videos, red needs immediate action. So I checked the message and it said “flaps not 0” or something like that.
Of course I knew that I had just to press the D-Pad to set the flaps but I kept it realistic and started looking for the in cockpit flap controls. When I found 'em I set it to 0.
And while looking for the flaps I also realized that the gear is down!
So after I retracted the gear I tried to engage the AP again. It worked now but didn’t do anything, so I turned it off again.
The alarms were now off and I relaxed a bit. Now I started to wonder about our heading. Are we still on course? I had no idea, I just knew that we should reach Florida soon. But because of clouds I couldn’t see anything. So I decided to bring the plane below the clouds.
I thought I saw land at one point but it turned out to be more clouds. After a while I started losing hope and thought we’re way of course.
But then, finally, land! And, I almost couldn’t believe it, just minutes after reaching Florida I spotted a large Airport! So maybe we still were on course and that’s Miami? No idea, don’t care, any Airport is fine!
So I tried to fly a loop to get to the airport but I completely lost orientation and couldn’t find it anymore. So I started to just fly around and after a while I saw the Airport again. Or maybe it was another one, no idea. I tried my best to keep it in sight and get closer. I made three attempts to approach a runway and land, but every time auto throttle engaged and ruined my attempt. At this point I seriously had little hope left.
But then I did it! Somehow this time auto throttle didn’t interfere and I landed the plane without crashing and, according to the game, even without damaging the plane.

I just couldn’t believe it! And I still don’t. That just can’t be even close to realistic!

Now I wonder what everyone else thinks and if there are ppl here who tried this themselves. I’m sure there are some!

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Hi, welcome aboard! Please may I suggest adding a PS5 tag to your new thread? Thanks, enjoy!

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playstation tag added and title amended to reflect PS5 perspective.

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Just tried to edit but couldn’t find a PS tag. Just PC, X-Box and others.

But will it matter? Are the physics simplified on consoles?

Personal Comments and Observations

I think this conversation may need to be considered by the fact that the PlayStation experience is still being fleshed out. There’s clearly some work to do in terms of bug-fixing and making that console’s experience aligned with PC and XBox. Just look at the all the bugs reported on the FMS behavior alone shows there’s some differences to be worked out in the sim and underlying components. This isn’t anything surprising - XBox underwent the same situation when it was opened to MSFS 2020 year ago.

To that end, it may take a few Sim Updates to get PS5 in alignment, that’s just my read of the tea leaves.

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Yeah, I agree, but I don’t get how this does impacts the topic. The only bug I experienced here was that the flight started out of control and with flaps set and gear down. Although in my case this bug was perfect because I wanted to simulate exactly this situation - something happening mid flight with both pilots gone and the plane out of control.

I think part of the issue might be that you started “in-flight.” There’s a lot of initialization that occurs when a flight doesn’t start in a Cold & Dark configuration - much more so if it’s airborne as opposed to being on a helipad or runway end. That means things that have been turned on or set in a certain state may need to be adjusted for PS5.

Again, it’s early days for PS5 - if you filter by Playstation tags, you’ll see a pattern of sorts. I personally haven’t done anything more than a superficial analysis for my own curiosity, but there’s a lot of avionics-related and some flight model/aircraft behavior related potential defects reported. That doesn’t imply they’re validated, it’s just that players reported it as happening.

Long story short, it’s early days for PS5. You’ll need to give it more time to mature, PC and XBox saw the same, we’re just ahead of the software development curve than the new arrivals.

Sorry @CasualClick , I don’t get it. This is not a bug report, I’m not complaining, this is a discussion and the topic isn’t related to bugs at all (besides what I said in the post before this one).

I simply wanna talk about how realistic this Sim is.

@CasualClick

I think perhaps you’ve missed the point. Never mind all the controls and stuff bound to different hardware.

I think the OP has a valid point - could Joe or Josephine Average jump in a cockpit and land a plane like the A330 and hope to land it without a scratch?

Next question and this one is from me: Are the physics different on the PS5 as opposed to the XBox or PC? Would he have had a different experience vis-a-vis landing the A330 undamaged on the XBox or PC?

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*So, I set up a flight from Europe to Miami with the A330, which I haven’t touched before. 200+ ppl on board. All assists off, everything set to “realistic”. I started in air about an hour away from the destination.

And it was perfect, because when I clicked “ready to fly” the plane was immediately out of control with alarms ringing.*

And this is why you can’t separate the current state of PS5 experience from your discussion of realism - this should NOT have been the state of the plane when you entered the cockpit in an “already airborne” state. :smiling_face_with_sunglasses: Certainly you could deliberately invoke conditions or take actions to artificially induce an emergency but most aircraft when entered airborne are relatively stable and in nominal operating state.

So having a discussion of sim realism requires a level of stability to the sim that so far is hit or miss for PS5. That’s what I’m conveying. Nothing more.

I’m confused. Maybe it’s my English?

This bug was there but it has no impact on the topic. If the flight would have started bug free, I would have have brought the plane out of control myself because I wanted to simulate an emergency.

So, forget this bug please. It has nothing to do with the topic I would like to discuss.

Edit: Just to be clear I will compress my post as much as I can:

I have very little experience with this Sim and I have very little knowledge about aviation and Airliners. Still I have been able to land a A330 safely without damage and so I wonder how realistic this Sim is. Some Pilots say that something like this is extremely unlikely if not impossible.

The difference is that I would have a stroke or a heart attack from the stress of landing a real airliner.

Goofing it up the sim, no matter how well practiced, results in, “Oops!” and a chuckle or two.
IRL? That’s way too much pressure.

Good topic though!

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Yep, I do not think a relative newbie would land an airbus, although, don’t they have an autoland feature? I’m more Boeing than airbus.
If i’m the passenger, I would be the one who is suddenly intent on doing a thesis on my phone to avoid eye contact :sweat_smile: !
Notwithstanding, in @CasualClicks defence, I have both PC and PS5. They are different with respect to functionality and bugs and of course for me a big learning curve to fly with controller - which I just could not get the hang of so bought a hotas 4, added a mouse and keyboard (which is not fully functional on a PS5).

The PS5 is much more of a gamiefied experience with the throttles all working of one throttle lever and everything to hand, with aircraft being started just with R bumper and down arrow - everything just is easier. So yes, a PS5 is not a realistic experience.
If you can one day or if you eventually want to, try a mates PC with it on with a set of really good medium or expert sim throttles and yoke/stick. Fly with a really well done GA plane like the A2A products or Black Square products or an airliner from PMDG, Fenix or Inibuilds. The systems depth is very different from the base sim planes.

It is possible though, I think in an emergency, for one of the guys who know the sim planes/airliners really well and have been simming for many years to possibly help out in a situation (which I agree is unlikley to happen).

A product that could perhaps improve realism and immersion on consoles a little : A PC controller dedicated to flight simulation… maybe one day on PS5?

(Honeycomb echo aviation controller)

If you’re using only a gamer controller, that will have a lot to do with it. Once more peripherals come available for the PS, you’ll find it’s much easier to control the aircraft because you’re not continuously switching modes in order to turn knobs and flip switches. This is very distracting and the biggest reason I won’t even attempt to play using Cloud Gaming. It’s a totally different experience.

For reference, here’s my Xbox setup.

Perhaps the simulation is realistic and you’re simply a very skilled pilot… or lucky one :wink:

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Sorry folks, it seems like few people here really get the point of my post. As I said, maybe it’s my English, it’s not my first language.

I simply would like to know how realistic the flight physics and the aircraft systems are simulated in this game. Is it a sim or rather a simcade?

I give you another example: Meanwhile I also tried other aircraft. One of those was the F-18. I thought a fighter jet would be rather difficult to fly but it’s the opposite - it’s super easy to fly and I just have a hard time to believe that’s realistic.

Hey there and welcome aboard! First of all, you’re english is fine. Second, I’ll try to add to what @CasualClick mentioned.

There are two or three things that he’s pointing out, and they should change with future updates. Your post refers to realism, and to that there are two aspects:

  • What the sim does, regardless of it being close to reality or not
  • The amount of realism of the simulation

So, as @CasualClick mentioned, and in regard of the first point, the sim shouldn’t have started that way (and actually, almost no one starts an airliner in flight). An airliner requires several things that start from cold and dark, for example, setting the IRS (the navigation system), programming the FMS (Flight Management System), setting the weight, performance, etc, which affect how the airplane will behave at landing. The sim, behaving properly, should not start in a control loss. It doesn’t matter if this is a bug or not, what I think he’s trying to point out is that the sim behaviour in your platform is in its early stages, and your experience may vary in the future (I also don’t know how polished are the airplanes, etc.).

Then there’s the second point how close to a real-life behaviour is the sim:

In reality, there are several aspects of a real life experience that aren’t simulated in MSFS 2024 (or in any other home sim). You need a Class D simulator (a real simulator for pilots) to actually see if you can manually land an airplane. In the Mentour Pilot video (I think it’s the one with Tom Scott), first of all they’re in a Class D simulator, and second, IIRC he wasn’t able to manually land an airplane (only with the AP and help from Petter he was able). In real life, even making a “pattern” around an airport with an airliner is virtually impossible while keeping an eye on the airport (distances are really big, an approach requieres certain precision, etc.). But that’s another discussion! In real life, most probably you should have crashed. Even aligning a real airplane with the runway is really hard. The sim is a sim, with some things closer to reality (procedures for example), and some which aren’t really close to reality (flying, not only for the lack of feel, but also for the simulation shortcomings). You need to take the realism with a grain of salt. From a real-life simulation perspective, the sim (and almost all sims) are valid for practicing procedures, but not that much for a real flight experience.

Hope this helps to explain our comments. We understand you’re not reporting a bug, and we are telling you that your future experience with the sim might vary (actually, should vary in the future).

Hope this helps!

Best

Seb

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Thank you!

Yes, absolutely! And as mentioned I’m aware this is a bug and I’m also aware that the PS version, being the newest one, has probably more bugs than any other version. Still I thought it’s not relevant for my topic, but:

I’m aware of this, but I thought (and still think) that the sim does all that when starting a flight mid air. Is that not the case?

Absolutely agree!

Ok, I guess I had just wrong expectations here. I’m pretty active in sim-racing and for this there are several options with various degrees of realism. You have games like Need for Speed or The Crew Series, which are clearly not realistic at all and therefore categorized as “Arcade”. Then there are games like Assetto Corsa or GT7, which try their best to get the physics close to real life, but may not simulate every aspect. GT7, for example, doesn’t simulate tire pressure or engine/transmission stress. Those are usually labeled “Simcade”

And then there are games like iRacing or Le Mans Ultimate, which try to get as close to IRL as possible. Many real life racing drivers are playing those. Max Verstappen, for example, is very active in iRacing and said that it’s pretty close to reality when it comes to the cars behavior. Those are the “Sims”.

So, from my experience so far and from what you and others answered here, it looks like MSFS is more a Simcade. Pretty realistic when it comes to procedures and setting up systems, but with simplified flight physics and maybe also simplified depth when it comes to the simulation of Airliner systems.

And that’s fine, I have no problem with simcades at all, I have 2000+ hours on GT7 for example.

I guess I had just wrong expectations because I always heard about MSFS being a super realistic sim.

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In Fairness to IRacing and this Flight simulator - the iRacing sim does not download or stream the entire world as this one does. This Sim is the most complex game/sim because of the shear no of simobjects required, aircraft, scenery, flight management systems, navigation requirements, the ability to tack on 3rd party extras and have it work etc etc.
Many of the 3rd party and MS/Asobo participate in RL airliner simulators.

You lose the other senses you get from IRL flying like movement L and R, up, down, lookinh around yourself etc so of course those can’t be simulated in here unless you have a very expensive chair that simulates these movements and extra screens with VR.

The fact that all of those are possible in here if you can spend the cash makes it as close to realism as one could expect.