Milviz C310R Official Thread

I’m really looking forward to this being my first MilViz product. I’ve heard great things, the Corsair and the Porter just aren’t up my alley.

I have a hankering for system depth and I really hope it lives up to the hype in that regard. This isn’t supposed to be a dig, I’m just feeling very let down this week by a certain other highly-anticipated Twin.

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Well, I’m a bit apprehensive as to how great it will be, considering all the limitations Asobo still seems to have in FS. The plane’s designers and coders are at some point at the mercy of what the sim allows them to do. I will probably purchase it as my first paid plane for MSFS. I’m also considering the Kodiak but haven’t pulled the trigger yet. I have high hopes for this 310 but until it’s out and I see the reviews, I’ll be skeptical. Let’s hope it’s outstanding!

There is another more than promising twin in the making:

This one might even beat the Milviz Cessna 310 quality-wise, we will see :slight_smile:
And it´s a premiere in FS20 of a feature only X-Plane had until now: Clickable spots on the outside of the airplane to open various hatches and lids.

Great times for private aircraft fans! Also delivering a different and interesting weather radar:

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Wow, that Flysimware 414 looks amazing also. Hopefully, the depth of its systems is as good as their animations, gauges, and lighting! The current issues with turbocharged engines may cause some trouble unless they custom code their own engine model, which would undoubtedly be difficult.

I tend to agree with @SkySteve53 though. With the sim’s current limitations, I fear that achieving the level of systems depth that people such as myself would desire is going to be very difficult. That being said, am still hopeful that as the sim is updated with more capability the addons will be updated to reflect that as well.

Definitely looking forward to both of these aircraft now!

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Care to speak more about the turbocharging issues? I’ve been using the Turbo Bonanza mod since inception and have no reason to go back to an NA motor.

Are you sure you’re not referring to turboprops?

I am sure, although I would also say there are issues with turboprops. Basically, turbocharged aircraft IRL are supposed to make maximum power with the mixture full rich all the way up to the critical altitude, at which point you begin leaning for best power. In the sim, you need to be pulling the mixture back as you climb for max power, even below the critical altitude. This is unrealistic and there is a mod that does a very good job of fixing this in the Turbo Bonanza as well as the Seneca and Turbo Arrow.

More info:

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Looking forward to this plane. Please don’t release it too early. Just look at the Twin Otter released a couple of days ago which has had a very mixed reception.

I hope the sounds on the 310 are on point :slight_smile: I’m expecting good things from Milviz based on previous releases and the reputation that they have built in MSFS to date.

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Because I am not yet fully convinced about this “supercharger / turbo bug” in the flight sim, I needed to ask some more infos about this topic in the PMDG Cloudmaster forum…

Air is getting thinner for a turbine wheel also, and the turbo is getting less and less dense air with less and less oxygen molecules to compress, and therefore the mixture will get too rich while climbing.

Ahhh yes, I’ve noticed this as well and thought it was incredibly odd, as in the past I’ve taken the Bonanza into the FL’s and had the mixture teetering on the edge of flooded, LOP, and cutoff. I don’t recall ever having flown a TS engine in P3D, FSX, or FS9 so I can’t recall if the issue was carried across, but after reading the threads it’s now most definitely apparent and sad on Asobo’s behalf they haven’t visited the topic again.

I’m now interested to see how the Asobo P51 and AH P51 handle while climbing up to 25,000 feet and seeing the engine performance. In DCS I never recall having to lean for my P47 or P51 as well.

Thanks for the links

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@GamingCat2130 If I may quote from the Lycoming page you linked:

  • If manual leaning of the mixture is permitted at takeoff, climb power or high-performance cruise, it will be specified in the POH/ AFM and will list required ranges for fuel flow, power settings and temperature limitations.

So, it defers to the POH of the specific aircraft.

Using the PA-28RT-201T Turbo Arrow as an example, the POH for that states that climb should be done with the mixture at full rich. (See section 4, page 10).

image

It does not elaborate further on this, so I looked up the TSIO-360-FB operator’s manual and found that it says the following:

“Climb at 75% power and above must be done at “FULL RICH” mixture setting…”

Here is my understanding of why this is, based on my cursory knowledge of the Turbo Arrow and my knowledge of turbocharged aircraft engines.

The Turbo Arrow has a fixed wastegate system. It is ground adjustable, but it does not automatically adjust itself to prevent overboosting (exceeding the maximum manifold pressure). At sea level, it is very easy to overboost the Turbo Arrow, which is why you do not set full throttle for takeoff. As you climb, you have to continually increase the throttle to maintain the maximum manifold pressure. Eventually, you reach 100% throttle. The altitude at which this occurs is the critical altitude.

This is actually a correct statement, it’s just not accounting for the fact that the turbocharger is not working at 100% capacity when you’re at sea level because you would overboost the engine. Once past the critical altitude, the turbo is working at 100% and can no longer compress enough air to maintain maximum MP, so the power begins to drop off, and the mixture gets too rich, as you described.

As a side note, on aircraft/engines with automatic wastegates, you put the throttles to full at any altitude and the system should automatically adjust the wastegates to maintain maximum MP until the critical altitude is reached.

Hopefully this helps!

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As an A&P your understanding of the systems are correct.

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I am happy to hear that! It sure would be embarrassing to type all that out and be wrong lol.

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I hope they release this soon so they can focus on the most important upcoming aircraft - the ATR 72.

By the way… when thinking of turbine aircraft I must always think of the wonderful King Air.
Is anyone making a study-level King Air 350?

Thanks for the good explaination. I am going to test the Turbo Arrow a little bit to see how the engine behaves. Have not flown it for a while because it´s too frustrating not being able to finish the interior texture overhaul because of texture file incompatibilities with normal- and bumpmaps and therefore always seeing this half-finished interior with this ugly driveshaft hump texture bug on the carpet.
But as far as I can remember the overboost light in the Arrow goes off in 7000 or 8000 feet altitude or so and leaning the mixture becomes necessary.

Yes the ATR 72 will definitely be a statement plane for Milviz

Just to get this topic back on subject- the Cessna 310R doesn’t have turbocharged engines. (Just normally aspirated IO-520‘s)

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No effort has been spared to overcome, get around, or otherwise avoid some of the sim’s limitations in all the areas which it’s really important to do. There’s just one that we’re not completely sure we can completely get around, but we’re still working on it with good results so far. We didn’t spend all this time and effort to bring you anything but the very best we know how to do.

You’ll be the judge of the results, but whatever you decide, it won’t be for lack of trying to get everything absolutely as right as we can.

Dutch

Project lead and lead systems coder for the Milviz C310R for MSFS.

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Why would you feel the need to post about a competitors product in a thread devoted to the 310?

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It is brilliant. An excellent model with very few (minor) glitches. It’s the way it should be done, IMHO. I can’t stop flying it! :slight_smile:

That said, I’m very much looking forward to the MilViz 310. They do excellent work as well. The Corsair is outstanding.

Can you share what that is? I certainly understand if not, but that piques my curiosity! In any case, I’m very much looking forward to this aircraft!