I think I may have answered this elsewhere, but SimConnect will not be available on XBox. XBox cannot listen for TCP connections as a server, so in order for SimConnect to work, it would need to have some kind of peer-peer mode added where the client is actually the TCP host (probably negotiated using UDP discovery or some kind of cloud assisted discovery). Since none of that is in the SimConnect protocol, that would be a change for sure. In-process usage of SimConnect using WASM will not be affected, since those become local method calls.
I feel like this implies that there’s been a lack of transparency, but I would have to say I think everyone has been super transparent about what we’re working on and what the platform aims are, between the numerous comments we’ve made publicly in these forums, on Avsim, and on our Discord, as well as the combined comments by Jorg on the dev Q&As and Alyzee, Eric, and Sylvain on the SDK Q&As. Nothing I said up there was anything I haven’t said before.
I’m very happy that Asobo seems committed to going back and making airports and such better, even if it does “compete” with 3rd party developers. If the base game gets better, there’s more chance that people will try it and keep using it, which in turn means more potential buyers for the 3rd party devs. Plus, if I’m being very honest, the fewer 3rd party things like airports or weather I have to buy the better. I’m happy for the base game scenery and such to keep improving, so that I can rather spend my money on aircraft. Making the scenery, ATC, weather etc better in the base game is good for all of us and I hope they keep improving it.
@SofaJockey you wont notice if you don’t use active addins like LittleNavmap.
Aha. Thanks for confirming the issue. That’s imho bad news for any serious MSFS flightsimmer who would consider buying XBox-X as a replacement for low end PC hardware.
As far as information is considered, there has been very little put out officially, about the decision to abandon SimConnect for XBox. The question was put in the Q&A recently, and word was “we can’t announce it” or something.
Returning to the topic here, as far as I know (and people talk thruth about it) at least some trusted 3th party developers were left in the dark, below was submitted by a trusted third party developer, only 12 days ago in the main topic about this…with the intention to put our minds to rest, it would work until a replacement would be available. Also the network version. I’ll leave out the name, you can find it back there if needed.
… so that is not true, SimConnect won’t be treated as common “legacy” for 2-5 years, it will be removed, at least for XBox-X, before there is any replacement. Period. I certainly hope they won’t abolish this proven technology for the PC version as well !! Common sources for PC and XBox… wasn’t that the plan ?
Above developer is right. There is definitely a way forward. Same machine (localhost) and don’t forget kids hook up their XBox devices all the time… and Microsoft published a procedure involving XBox Console Companion on PC, in order to connect to their XBox device from a PC ! with PC as client. Someone could make a simple driver for it… when Microsoft would release an API for the same method that XBox Console Companion uses to connect.
The principle here is dead right (speaking as an Xbox ‘dad’).
But Xbox is a platform where things should be easy and ‘just work’.
I did pick up a HOTAS and pedals. When It comes to the marketplace, I’ll likely have a few things, but those things will need to work nicely in-game. I can’t ‘swap to desktop’ on an Xbox.
EDIT: I’ll make a final observation that as an Xboxer, there is a great deal that is going right over my head, but perhaps I will learn.
Hmm you don’t have to use all that, @SofaJockey… Actually, I’m not into ATC and avionics… I don’t have many SimConnect requirements myself… being a 9 months user now, I only depend on LittleNavMap… and XBox-X not having any way to connect to that would be a showstopper for me. No purchase !
Hi ! Yes you ‘re right !!! I talk for FlightControlReplay (my baby ) . I had negative answer from Microsoft to support simconnect networked in Xbox system
Unfortunatelly he don’t support simconnect outside the wasm black box …. (At least for now he stated in one of the last dev q&a sdk) .
I think have simconnect networked way to connect to msfs is important not only for all 3rd party developer (at least the official 3rd developer like myself) .
A lot of games in Xbox use udp port at least for get data (see codemasters f1 saga for example) .
I understand the fear from Asobo to open a breach into the Xbox OS . It can be very hard manage this … but never say never ….
I hope ms and Asobo find a solution for all third party tool developer to reach also Xbox platea
Btw I know also motion platform company cannot have access to raw data
This entire statement is totally and completely false. The SimConnect API is not being deprecated, and there are no plans not to continue to support it. The codebase for the XBox and PC version are 100% the same codebase, and I know because I’m looking right at it right now.
XBox simply cannot use the SimConnect network protocol as it exists today, because it cannot listen for TCP connections as a host. This is the total and complete reason why that part of it cannot happen on XBox, because it is technically impossible. Other products that connect to XBox do not rely on simple TCP listening, they use a variety of techniques (such as UDP and cloud assisted discovery) that allow clients to be the socket listener.
As mentioned before (on the same thread even that you referenced, by myself), it will require work to do and more importantly it would be a change in the connection initiation protocol and API, which will break existing addons. As Seb said directly in the Q&A, it is something we will look at down the road a bit later in time.
Again, just to be super clear to any third party devs (and I’m deeply sorry that threads like this pop up and confuse the matter), the SimConnect API is not being deprecated, and any existing in-process SimConnect calls will continue to work just fine on XBox. It is simply technically impossible with the present SimConnect protocol to connect to a networked XBox. We will investigate down the road a bit what protocol expansions are necessary and talk to partners and third parties who will experience breakage how we would all like to move forward, together.
This thread has gone “OFF TOPIC” , in discussing details about SIMCONNECT & XBOX
BUT
There was obviously some misunderstanding about X-BOX and Simconnect, and the fact that that misunderstand was both raised, and answered is a very Positive thing, so all good !!
I’m a developer too. Keep in mind this is not a rant against MS or WT, I’m just invoking some questions, because there seems to exist broad uncertainty about these topics among developers and hobbyists writing freeware for flightsim.to. It would be nice to get some answers about SimConnect. Your previous question contained ONE very clear answer: XBox-X can have no peripheral connection to a PC client to talk to the sim, using SimConnect. That’s what all these programs do. Glad to hear you’ll going to keep it in for PC…
So MSFS will have SimConnect API, also on XBox… only it cannot be accessed by TCP, it requires a new protocol to connect. For non-savants here… I listed some 20 popular addins above, currently depending on SimConnect, partly freeware, partly payware… using TCP. many of these addins, especially VATSIM and Littlenavmap and possibly many more I am not aware of, are used by the PC MSFS community. Can these addins be adjusted to UDP or whatever protocol easily ? Will UDP be needed to do things on PC also ? and will Microsoft be inclined to publish this UDP interface, so freeware can keep making use of it ? There will be identification packages… encryption…
Even if there was a “new UDP or whatever protocol”, would not these Apps have to be on the MS-Store for them to be even loaded onto the Xbox, or would they need to run a PC, which adds extra complexity to the clean, simple X-Box as a gaming device.
I really feel for the majority of X-BOX users who will rush out and buy an X-BOX, without realizing the limitations that X-BOX would seem to present to MSFS players.
It would be informative to see, a simple, easy to read document ion, of exactly what will and wont work using an X-BOX for MSFS, as compared with a PC, and exactly what the pros & cons are, without delving into masses of complex technicalities.
Also, a clear statement of the Pro-Cons of buying from the MS-Store vs Steam and how those product purchased can be used, or not used, on both PC and/or X-box - or not.
Also, a clear statement of the update process (and costs) when updating from basic to Premium/Deluxe MSFS.
This would be my understanding of “Transparancy”
FYI: I consider that i really “Lucked out” when I purchased MSFS without having the above information.
I purchased the Premium/Deluxe from the MS-store, to run on a PC.
So I did not have to effective re-buy MSFS for the full Deluxe price to get Deluxe, and I do not have to deal with Steam., and if, for any reason I want to buy an X-Box , I can run what I have already purchased, on that X-BOX …
@N6722C these apps don’t need to load onto the XBox-X, or be aquired from the XBox-Store… they can be installed elsewhere, because SimConnect allows for a network connection… that’s the whole issue.
Example: when there is no native XBox version of the LittleNavmap program… what to do, if you need your aircraft position to show up on the map, having LittleNavmap on a tablet, or laptop ? How would VATSIM be able to access your aircraft…
(your other remarks better be answered by Bishop398…)
OK, so then you would have any non-ms-store authorized App, connecting and communicating with the X-Box, via whatever this new Network Connection method is.
I don’t know who would answer those other questions or provide that documentation, but I was NOT suggesting or requesting that anything about this should be coming OFFICIALLY from WT – they have enough on their plate
Well, as long as only MSFS answers, why not ? the program runs somewhere else… if I access some server with Putty, my Putty program does not need any certification from that server, other than being compliant to the https safety layer. It keeps the protocol, and I’m responsible for sending the commands.
The TCP protocol is always directed to ONE recipient. UDP is not. There will always be certain vulnerabilties… e.g. what if some PC using UDP broadcasts would impersonate an XBox device ? having my PC sending over account data or e-mail addresses in return ? No network protocol is perfectly protected… the new module should take these scenarios into account, good software needs to do that.
Some questions can only be answered by the people who are going to release. Bishop398 is involved in that and I’m gratefull he is here… and curious what is needed to just let it work.
Of course… for you little would change (you don’t use above tools ? ) my question is… what will be the differences ? I don’t really worry, I always have my laptop to run MSFS on. But I would prefer to be able to run full DX-12_2… and use LittleNavmap… and further develop my own SimConnect hobby projects. Now I can do that on a PC, because there are plenty of SDK examples… Simconnect is documented. Can I do the same for XBox ? Developers (the official ones) have these questions too. It is part of this topic.
) . I had negative answer from Microsoft to support simconnect networked in Xbox system
No network protocol is perfectly protected… the new module should take these scenarios into account, good software needs to do that.