Still NO Adverse Yaw Effect on C152 and C172

I am really disappointed on how they still didn’t fixed the fundamental part of the flying: Adverse Yaw Effect…!!! Even Microsoft Flight Simulator X have this effect! Wondering why they never fixed this! Each and every time when I make a steep bank turn Its keeps hammering my mind, “why? why this is still not here in this wonderful sim!”.

Also when I put everything in the assistance on hard! It is still having that thing what I used to call it: INDUCED GOD RUDDER! Which is automatically compensating for the adverse yaw effect.

This should be fixed in order to enjoy the full flight simulation experience. What is your thoughts and opinions? Thanks.

EDITED: This discussion is very sensitive! so we have to be clear in this.

The topic that I have created is the Adverse Yaw Effect. Which is the initial tendency of the aircraft which slips to the right when you make a left turn (without using the rudder at all). In this condition the ball in the turn coordinator will go to the left side indicating the pilot to use the left rudder! At this point, pilot should apply left rudder to coordinate his flight. If he applies more rudder the aircraft goes to skid!

When pilots make left turns to his final approach (coordinated: applying left rudder) he/she might apply more left rudder which is very dangerous! (Different topic). Nevertheless, at this time the ball in the turn coordinator goes to the right side! which indicates that pilot should apply right rudder to compensate skid. Again, if he applies more right rudder the aircraft goes to slip again.

I think this explains the current situation. Correct me if I said anything wrong! Thanks.

An awesome video that visualises the Adverse Yaw Effect!

Here is the direct comparison of MSFS2020! (Turning left and right without rudder)

NOTE: Significant improvements have been made by MSFS2020 dev team including Adverse Yaw Effect. Keep up the good work. Once I test the adverse yaw effect and if it is fixed. I will make this post as fixed (solution found). Thanks to MSFS2020 team for your level of transparency and dedication towards improving this sim. Much appreciated.

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ok so I think the issue is tied to the autopilot yaw damper.

I thought perhaps the “modern” flight mode might have been it so I switched to the “classic” mode
And still has the compensating yaw. I tested the mode out on the x cub., while in it I noticed the YD,
I cant turn it on or off, but, the effect is that it is on.

It’s just a hunch but it might be that the YD is just always on.

EDIT: I was also perplexed as to why there was no need for yaw imput while flying around and was going to make a topic when I saw your post.

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OKAY, I’m not crazy then… Very little to no rudder needed to keep coordinated turns…

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Yes, maybe YD is the issue. If that so, it should be disabled when user puts the assistance settings to TRUE TO LIFE. Else “TRUE TO LIFE” has no meaning in the flight sim. Well, you don’t have to be true to your life in a game. At least, be true to the aircraft simulation :stuck_out_tongue:

Is there a universal yaw damper that we can disable? Would be nice to have some realistic adverse yaw, especially in the Cub types.

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The rudder should have a remake, I first noticed when departing with the carbon cub. Normally the effect of the tail rudder should increase with increasing airspeed. This is not the case here, thus it makes takeoffs very messy and it does not need as much as IRL.

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If you add a few more !!! I think they’ll get right on it!

The Yaw Damper button doesn’t seem to work on any plane actually.

I just logged this as a defect. I tried the “hidden” 'Ctrl+D" command and this does nothing.

It’s certainly possible to kick the ball out of the basket with your rudder pedals, but stop applying input, and back it drifts.

There has to be a way to disable this, so I am assuming for the moment that this is a bug, and Asobo aren’t treating us like fools.

Is there an equivalent to the XP datarefs, where this “feature” is enabled, and we might be able to force it off?

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CTRL-D? There is a CTRL-R for “auto rudder” but it also doesn’t help. I suspect it was released this way as they were unable to get it working properly before release.

the xCub is a real letdown here…

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I was referring to the PDF floating around which lists “Ctrl+D” as “Toggle Yaw Damper”.

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Which PDF? is that an official document?

I doubt it, or it’s a leak. You can find it all over but I have added some links below, as I cannot attach PDFs. There are many of them, and some show the yaw damper, some do not.

For example, this one does not:

This one does:

I think the version I downloaded yesterday was actually from this site, but I’m not sure where it originated from. It has green text denoting the sections.

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In the flight model config file for c172 g1000 I found the following two entries with “adverse yaw” in them:

yaw_moment_roll = 0.058 ; (adverse yaw) The change in yaw moment per change in roll rate deg/s

and

yaw_moment_delta_aileron = 0.004 ; (adverse yaw) The change in yaw moment per change aileron deflection

Thoughts?

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There are a few more than that. Using Notepad++ to look for “damping”:

pitch_moment_pitch_damping = -420.537 ; The change in pitch moment per change in pitch rate(PRIMARY PITCH STABILITY FACTOR). deg/s
roll_moment_roll_damping = -8.167
yaw_moment_yaw_damping = -13.226 ; (damping)The change in yaw moment per change in yaw rate(PRIMARY YAW STABILITY FACTOR deg/s)
yaw_moment_yaw_damping = -13.226 ; (damping)The change in yaw moment per change in yaw rate(PRIMARY YAW STABILITY FACTOR deg/s)
yaw_moment_yaw_propwash = 0 ; (damping)

I think I may have to have a play around with these after work. I’ll be interested to see how it flies if I set the yaw damping to 0.

From having a dig around, some aircraft have a “flight_model.cfg”, and some do not. My first thought on this was that these must be the “encrypted” or protected premium aircraft, to stop piracy, but when I looked closer I found several “generic” folders for different kinds of craft, such as single engine, multi-engine, turboprops etc.

In each of these folders is a full set of config files, so my assumption is that if there is an aircraft without some files, then it just uses the “generic” set that is applicable.

In other words, the aircraft designer was lazy! :slight_smile:

What it might mean is you could copy that “generic” config into the aircraft folder and tweak it to make it more specific.

Another important one to play with may be this:

yaw_moment_slip_angle = 0.345703 ; The change in yaw moment per change side-slip angle(WEATHER VANING EFFECT)

I did have a quick play around with some of these, and even with ridiculous values, both plus, and minus, I don’t see much effect on the aircraft. I was testing on the 152, about as simple as it gets.

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Same with 172, insane values and no change in behavior. Simple thing this is currently “ignored” or overruled. When they get the SDK more polished and plane maker in dev mode, maybe we can really play.

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Im also beginning to think that weight has absolutely no effect, other than visual.

I need to do more thorough tests, but with the C208, at 99% load it takes off just as easily as when near empty. It’s even worse on landing, and can still drift along on idle for ages, even floating over the runway.

Even odder, on taxi, if you first overcome friction and get it rolling, throttle all the way back to idle and it gradually accelerates, and just keeps on going, even if I feathter the prop.

The harder I look, the worse it seems to get.

I take it back, weight definitely has some visible effects. Although it seems odd that the 172 can rotate at just over 40kts whether it is empty, or fully loaded. But handling is certainly effected. Climb rate, and stall speed, is definitely altered.

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They haven’t put out the next update yet, its for September. Have a little patience. :roll_eyes:

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When will I be able to criticise in that case? The next patch, or the one after that?

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At least wait till after they’ve done an update. Complaining it “still hasn’t been fixed” before then is kind of silly.

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